Leadership lessons learned at a rock concert ...

An interview with Frank Turner on inclusion, diversity, kindness and begrudging leadership

Surrounded by 3,000 people in the packed Camden Roundhouse - I was expecting to get warm beer spilled on me, to be squished into a sweaty armpit and to feel like one of the oldest people in the room – I wasn’t expecting to stand there reflecting on the power of inclusion advocacy and leadership.

The gig started as you’d expect; a big entrance, a crowd favourite song - all standard, enjoyable, business as usual. But then, two songs in, the lead singer stopped and set out, what in a business environment we’d probably call a code-of-conduct. In a business environment, sure, we’d expect to see these rules and regulations pinned to the wall or included in our HR portal, but in the middle of a gig? What was he saying, and why did he feel it was so important?

The singer told us (using a lot of four letter words that I’ll use my own artistic license to amend) that in order for everyone to have a good time - everyone had to be mindful of those around them. That in no uncertain terms, we the audience ‘should not be unreasonable people’ (edited terminology!) I could feel everyone in the room nodding; 3,000 people all remembering that being respectful is simple and that it benefits everyone.

The singer went on to ask us all to say ‘hi’ to the Safe Gigs For Women (SGFW) team. We all dutifully said ‘hi’, as he pointed out that we shouldn’t have to live in a world where SGFW exists; but thank goodness it does. Then we said ‘hi’ to Stay Up Late; a charity which supports people with learning disabilities to ‘have a choice about how they live their lives’ and who’s members were in the room with us – who’s disabled members were to be treated, at this gig, as differently-abled.

Then as quickly as it had happened, it was over, we were back to singing and dancing, we were back to doing what was expected at a gig. But the unexpected is what’s stayed with me, the unexpected demonstration of leadership, of standing up for what you believe in and being an advocate for what you believe is right. The singer didn’t have to, he’d already sold the tickets, he already had an audience who wanted to sing along and boost his ego – so to go above and beyond, to remind us all be better, to be more kind – that struck me as special.

And as a demonstration of his awesome inclusive nature, after reading my blog, the singer, that I can now name - Frank Turner - kindly agreed to do an interview with me. Here’s what he had to say:

At your gigs, you take the time to remind everyone to be decent to each other, to not let their fun ruin someone else’s fun. Why do you do that? Because it strikes me as important. I'm an entertainer, first and foremost, so part of my responsibility is doing what I can to ensure everyone enjoys themselves at one of my shows. Beyond that, I think there's an opportunity to make the atmosphere at my shows reflect the values that I subscribe to (basically, classical liberalism), so it can be a salutary lesson in how we treat each other as individuals. You’re an ambassador for Safe Gigs For Women (SGFW), can you speak to why that’s important to you? One of the most prevalent and basic forms of abusive behaviour at shows is still, depressingly, men harassing women, sexually or otherwise. Any form of harassment is unacceptable, but this is a common headline issue. I encountered SGFW a few years back and immediately felt like I'd met some kindred spirits. You’re also supporting Stay Up Late, have there been any challenges in opening up your gigs to differently abled people? Not especially (though it should be stressed that I'm not the one doing the hard work here). The vast majority of people are, once the issue is highlighted for them, supportive of the idea. You describe yourself as someone who has a voice and a responsibility to use that voice, which could also be called leadership? I'm wary of the idea of being a leader. My politics are, at their very core, anti-authoritarian, and I think it's crucially important to make sure people have control over their own lives and decisions as much as possible. Obviously, at a show, when I'm standing on a stage performing to a crowd, I'm the focus of attention and there's a degree of hierarchy suggested by the layout of the room (if nothing else). Nevertheless, my chief message to impart, if I even have one, is that everyone is an equally sovereign individual, equally worthy of respect and consideration. If some of that comes across, I'd be happy. Thinking about diversity, inclusion and belonging – is there anything else you’d like to share? Mainly that I do my best (no doubt imperfectly) to be aware of the position that I speak and view the world from, and the privileges inherent in that. For example, I hadn't really thought about learning disabilities and shows before I encountered Stay Up Late, it just hadn't been part of my experience of life. I'm happy that that's something I now have at least some awareness of, but it's important for me to remain open to new ideas and perspectives

Massive love and thanks to Frank #bemorekind #inclusion #diversity #leadership